Monday, December 5, 2016

FA NETTELBECK's last interview

FA Nettelbeck in his father's lap
Fa Nettelbeck questions & answers

  • do you have a specific writing routine? Do you work at the same time everyday?
No routine, depending on the buzz or the hatred or the joy, I turn on the computor and hit the blog, the poem must go on.

  • Do you use thesauruses or etymological dictionaries?
Sometimes. I got a favorite one, stole it when I was a janitor in LA many, many years ago,  'The Pocket Dictionary of American Slang'. Has all the cool bebop drug addict shit in it. MY FAVORITE: "blow for canines", a jazz term when you're in that highest register, blowing like a motherfucker. But, TVs or newspapers and magazines or Google is what I use.
  • Do you ever go back to your earlier work and revise anything?
Yeah, sometimes I revise. Add more really. If it's really ALL fucked-up, then I gotta cut it down to bare bones for that ESSENCE.

  • How about notebooks? Do you carry around a notebook to jot down anything that you see?
I used to carry around notebooks ALL the time, my favorite was napkins in bars, but no, no I don't anymore as everything I write is on the blog. If I get an idea off the radio in the car or something I'll write it on my arm or some scraps of paper the old lady has in her purse.
  • What about Shelley’s poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world? What happened to that?
 I am not familiar with that from Shelly. Poets don't legislate shit. All they do is wipe ass for the lames so they can go home and talk dirty to their wives.
  • Is it enough to know that people are reading your work an enjoying it, or do you want more?
 Well, now that I'm an old fuck, yeah show me the money, I'd like to take my daughter to a museum and show her a REAL Mummy, not the ones at Wal-Mart, but really it IS sweet to know people dig your work.
  • Have you ever worked in prose? Ever been interested in writing plays?
Oh yes, I've written prose. Short stories. 'Everything Written Exists' is prose. Never wrote a play. I have NEVER READ a play. Seen a couple. I like Tennessee(sic) Williams' short stories better than his plays.
  • How much of what you write is actual dialogue that you’ve heard?
Dialogue is in there if it is CORRECT and reflects the street, the shit, the struggle. I put a lot of Dialogue in 'Bug Death' back when I was writing down EVERYTHING people said. The voices. The voices.
  • Do you ever go to diners to listen in on other people?
Shit, brother man, I couldn't even go to McDonald's! I AM one poor motherfucker. But when I was young and single and drunk, I'd listen in anywhere. I dig couples arguing in bars screaming their hatred, then they go home and fuck!
  • Are you interested in the visual arts-if so who or what?
Ed Ruscha. I don't keep up on art. Artists are whacked for the most part. I dig this digital artist, Bruce Bayard. My daughter was VERY cool about 3 years ago, but school tends to subdue that, you get more into 'coloring'. I was a pretty good artist, but I couldn't carry all that shit around. It's back to that notebook thing, they're easier to carry around
  • Do you keep a journal?
No, no journals. What for, I'd rather write a poem.
  • Have you ever considered publishing your correspondence?
Well, almost ALL of my correspondence is over at the Univ. of Ohio, and I don't think it'd be that interesting. I'm always complaining about being poor! I got a lot of e-mails to print out, but shit, I'd rather have a book of poems published!
Next part:
  • What do you do for a living? You mention being poor-I’m sorry but what jobs did you used to have?
I own the Squaw Flat Flea Market over in this little town here which has now turned into a ghost town due to the economy. Weed sales used to be good but that bottomed out years ago due to all these medical marijuana growers giving away the shit for free. I do whatever I can hustle up. I've worked at the US Post Office, been a tilesetter, a janitor, tele-marketer, worked in a pear shed, caretook a junkyard, had an art gallery.....
  • What brought you to Oregon? I haven’t looked on the map but what kind of a place in Beatty? By the coast or in the desert? (I lived in Hillsboro from 78-80 but I’m from Jersey).
Too many cops where I was living in Calif., drunk drivings, etc. This is high desert here. My place overlooks the Sprague River. Good fishing. This is the Klamath Indian Reservation. Most of my righteous Indian partners are dead now. Have two ex-old ladies buried over at Paiute Cemetery along with a chunk of my heart.
  • What were the first poets to turn you on?
Richard Brautigan, Bukowski, Jim Morrison, Baraka.
  • Do you do any readings? You have CD’s right? What prompted you to go into this medium?
I just gave a reading with Kevin Opstedal (a tits-up poet) down in Santa Cruz in February. I'll be reading in Grants Pass on June 1st in honor of Oregon's 150 years of Statehood. The group SUNBURNED HAND OF THE MAN put those CD's out on their Manhand Label from old cassettes I did years ago. I'm also on that State of the Union CD. I've always read to accompaniment and recorded a lot of it.
  • When I mentioned that Shelley quote about poets being the unacknowledged legislators of the world, I was trying to draw out a comment by you about what do you think poetry does? Or what is poetry for?
Poetry done right stops time.
  • As follow up to the above, with the cultural landscape so crowded with everyone, uhhh, doing their own thing how can a writer be heard?
Take hostages.
  • Did you, or do you, have an agent? Did you, do you, have you ever approached academia or the publishing world with your poetry?
No, never had an agent. Academia can suck my dick. Some of my titles HAVE been published by some of the better Outsider houses. If you mean mainstream publishers, well you just ain't drunk enough yet.
  • Any regrets about not going that route-any stories about going that route and being fucked over?
The poet Tom Clark once told me that John Martin of Black Sparrow Press fame once asked him whose poetry should he be publishing. Well, Clark tells him, "Nettelbeck of course", and Martin just laughed at him. I'm on some blacklist. 

Subject: Fwd: Sam Cherry (95), Neeli's father, died Monday surrounded by family and friends

This just in... (FA sent me an email about Bukowski friend and photographer Sam Cherry’s passing. I shot back: Do you know Neeli?
What do you think of his biography of CB?

FA emailed me back: Oh yes, I know Neeli, but it has been many, many years.......... Jesus, a lot of years. Too bad about his father, but that IS a long rich life. I always dug his Bukowski pics. That one of him and Neeli on a Laugh Literary cover is priceless. You know, what I can remember of the biography (it's been years since I read it) is I didn't really like it. But, fuck it, here's to Sam Cherry.

Third set of questions to FA:

  • When you say you’re on some sort of Blacklist do you mean that seriously? Tongue in cheek? Humorously? All three?
Actually, I'm serious. I've been around 40 years now & publishing my shit and it's still the whispering behind my back, "Should we take him seriously?" Damn right, cocksuckers.

  • What does that mean? I don’t know much about the book business except a lot of famous writers are dead. Do you have ‘no commercial potential’? Even on an “un”-commercial level?
Yeah, 'no potential to become commercial', probably more like it

  • What about John Martin of Black Sparrow Press? I’m not really sure what his laughing at the poet Tom Clark’s suggestion you join their press.
Well, if you Googled him you know the story. He liked my stuff and did a lot of favorable reviews of it in places like the San Francisco Chronicle et al. I only met him one time and he seemed cool. Now, when I did that reading down there in Santa Cruz, Opstedal told me some shit that leads me to believe he is quite the asshole.

  • When you were a younger poet did you ever read published material and wonder why that poem got published and yours didn’t? Did you ever compare yourself to other poets or poems? Have you done it recently?
No I didn't. I would take reading something that really knocked me out and try to learn from it... as a means toward crafting my voice. The shit that WAS shit took only a half a line into it before I would turn the page. When you're young you stumble forward and thank god for thee GREATS who sustain you, help you up. Recently I compared myself, facially, to a young Michael McClure and I thought I was better looking.

·        What kind of cigarettes do you smoke? How long have you been with that brand? What attracted you to it in the first place? Did you know that TS Eliot smoked Kools? Why do you think he smoked Kools (and please don’t say: he liked them).
Well, now here is where I'm going to break your heart bro, I have NEVER smoked in my life! Never dug it. Of course thechronic, etc. etc. Growing up in LA/Inglewood, only the brothers smoked Kools. Maybe old T. S. was too hip?

  • How much of you is in the poems-or is it a character?
Man, it's all me, unless I'm riffing on some percieved situation or remembering someone who did this that or the other blah blah. I've known some crazy fuckers. Who ain't.
  • Did you really steal change and booze from Indians graves?
Oh yeah, booze, never did take that change. Saw kids do it, but that's kinda sweet, ya know? Fuck death. Jesus, one of my old dear friends and a great fucking poet, Greg Hall, died last week. I'm sick of death. The other day I counted all my dead Indian partners and sisters and stopped at around 65 in the last 25 years, got tired of counting. No expectations, just, I NEED A FUCKING BREAK!
  • If you did, were you visiting your ex wives?
Well, the very last time I, we, copped some booze was at a soul partners funeral, an Indian cowboy and general righteous motherfucker and after we burried him, after the funeral, me and these people, ALL Indians, except for my old lady, went back and someone left a half G of Potter's Whiskey (his favorite) on his grave, and we cracked it, poured a little out for him and hit and passed. Well, we took it with us, but down to the dregs, somebody poured what was left into an empty half pint bottle and we went and put that back. It's probably still there. Understand, we're all bros and sisters, so no need to start smudging nothing.
  • How did you get involved with Native American culture?
When I moved here it was ALL Indians, just less than 10 or so whites (families), and Indians were all who I hung with. I Had a Paiute old lady for years and she was my baby, but she got hit by a train, drunk. I married this other Paiute chick, but she's dead now, too. They're all dead. This place is a fucking ghost town. Now there are all these white assholes moving up from the Bay Area. If it was the old days, they'd keep on driving!
  • Which leads me to this, what is your ethnic background? Nettelbeck is an interesting name-I can’t say I’ve ever heard it before, what does it mean and or come from?
Nettelbeck is German. A very common name in Germany. Sandra Nettelbeck, that German movie director blah blah. But, there are people in Rhode Island who tell me the code word for their chronic is Nettelbeck!
  • What do the initials FA stand for?
Famous Author. HA! Fred Arthur.
  • What do people call you in real time, F or A?
People call me SIR, motherfucker. Just Fred. Indians call me Mr. Fred. Some people call me asshole. When I gotta do that literary stuff, they always call me FA and that's wierd. When I was a kid, sucking at the tit of that mimeo ink, d. a. levy was king, hence that F. A. bullshit.
  • Where were you first published?
I was first published in this mag called ARX out of Austin, Texas around 1969, early 1970. Some poem about getting pulled over and the cop wants to see my penis. "Expired Penis". Some stupid shit like that.

  • how do you catalog your poetry?
Man, I write down where I've been published and put it in this box. I got my books and that's all there. But, a couple years ago, I sold most all my contributor's copies to the mags I've been in since 1969 and of course got burned, but I was buying this property adjacent to the ranch so had to do it. Plus, there's a lot of shit in my OSU archive.
  • Do you have a master file or-do you keep a bibliography of yourself? Has anyone done it or is interested in doing one?
I think what you see on-line is other people doing it, not me. Yeah, yeah, again, I've recorded it all for myself. And yeah, I have got a bibliography written down, haven't added to it in years, but if somebody wanted to do it, it's all there.
  • That photo of you sitting in your father’s lap is evocative-where is it from? What did he do for a living? I see he’s drinking Ballatine and it looks like a sports page next to him, as well a cigarette pack. What kind? Where are you in the photo? Were these happy times or well-I don’t know, not happy times?
That picture of me and my dad was taken in Chicago, circa 1951. At that time he worked at a Sinclair gas station, but later hooked up with a childhood friend who talked him into becoming an Ironworker. As it turned out, he hooked up with this job in LA and the whole family moved there when I was 9-years-old.Yeah man, fucking right, Ballatine's! The three rings. The headline on that paper reads: WILLIAMS (Ted) TOP SLUGGER. I couldn't tell you what smokes he dug, but I'm sensing Chesterfield. HA, my whole family was poor motherfuckers, whacked out! Happy? Shit, man, dad was a prick, but in the years before he died we drank mega beers and bullshitted all the pain away. Which is probably Psych fodder somewhere.
  • What were you doing in the sixties? Were you draft able? Un-draft-able? Unwanted? Did you ever go to the Fillmore or any big rock concerts?
Now this is a great question. That move to LA blessed me to the tits. It was all fucking happening! I saw the Doors at the Inglewood "drop-in" (the town we moved to), this teen-post kinda joint where we'd go see Sky Saxon and the Seeds and Music Machine ("Talk Talk"). ANYWAY, a year and a half LATER, me and my partner took muscle relaxers and went and saw the Doors at the Hollywood Bowl! What a beautiful nite. I saw Hendrix and Credence at Devonshire Downs, The Airplane at Griffith Park. Saw Zappa and The Mothers all OVER LA, Cpt. Beefheart at the Santa Monica Civic and The Roxy. Then the Fabulous Forum kicked in and Zeppelin and Cream and Blind Faith and the Stones. FUCK, Blodwyn Pig (SIC) at the Whiskey, on and on and on. It was the time of Rock Festivals and what a fucking party. Janis Joplin gave me a bottle of 100 proof Smirnov and I hardly even drank back then! Anti-war protests in Golden Gate Park in SF. Camping out at Big Sur and around a bonfire here's Simon and Garfunkle (him wasted sliding down against a tree) but they DID try and sing a little bit! But it's hard to explain LA back then. I couldn't tell you all the music I seen/heard. What a fucking beautiful scene. See, before there were hippies we were lowriders in highschool and fucking proud of it and LA didn't seem that BIG so when we'd go to San Francisco and literally get DISSED by those hippie cocksuckers......... "Fuck LA, we got the Grateful Dead, where you coming from?", and we'd say, WE GOT THE MOTHERFUCKER DOORS ASSHOLES! and would NOT hesitate to fucking swing and that would blow their minds. I'm still proud of LA and I ain't been there in 30 years! I went to the Fillmore ONCE in SF and saw Traffic. John Barlycorn must die. John Hammond opened. A great show. Fuck, and the riots back then. I'd have to really think about all that shit. I Did get drafted in 1968. They had this ping-pong ball BINGO type of set-up on TV with birthdate numbers on it and I got a low one right after the Ed Sullivan Show or something. "Bingo!"  It was during the TET OFFENSIVE and I wouldn't fucking be here but I faked(?) being nuts and eventually got a 4-F deferment. I'm proud of that too. FUCK "their" wars. I fight my own.
4) They televised the draft like the lottery today? How often did it come on? Obviously I guess it was a local broadcast. So that happened to you in LA during TET? Forgive me, but a low number meant that you were close? Between finding out they wanted to see you and actually undergoing the physical was how long? I ask cos I’m wondering how long did a guy get to sit around worry about it.
Yeah they did it on Sunday night on TV. Prime time, nationally. Number 50 or below and you were fucked. I got number 41. So that was sunday night, by tuesday or wednessday I got my letter to report to the LA induction center. And they only gave you about a week to show up. Not much time. 
5) Do you see a day in the future where some type of compulsory military service will be enacted? Just like in Israel where everyone has to serve two years and then stay in the reserves. Obviously the one thing they learned from that war was that a draft will not help. Hell this Afghanistan thing is going on eight years now.
I don't know. I'm still waiting for the Revolution! Shit, you can't find any ammo in the stores, so somebody's stock piling it! 

1). The picture of the short haired woman passed out with blood around her eye is really disturbing. Did you take this picture? Who is it and what is the poem about it? The black can of King Cobra sitting on the table catty corner to her head is an odd beacon.
HA, HA, that's my wife. She flew off the back of a 4-wheeler a month ago. I thought it was kind of sexy. She's all healed up now. I just set my beer down to take the picture! She's got her hair pulled back. Art IS in the eye of the beholder..... 
2). It’s really exciting to me that you saw the Mothers in LA. Do you have any specific memories of the gigs? The same goes for Captain Beefheart. Now I know that you mentioned Jim Morrison as an early poetic influence but why not Beefheart? I’m a big fan of his non-sequiturs.
Oh man, they were fantastic. I remember one time I saw the ORIGINAL Mothers at the Shrine about 69? and Zappa and them just sat on chairs on stage the whole time finger-fucking rubber chickens! They didn't play any music! Another time I saw Zappa with a different set of Mothers playing at UCLA with Zubin Mehta and the LA Philharmonic. After his set, Zubin sez this is NOT a rock and roll concert and he introduces Zappa and they come out playing 'Louie Louie'! Pretty funny. Beefheart was great. I saw him once at the Santa Monica Civic a little after TROUT MASK and he was somewhat portly twirling around the stage in a cape. Another time I saw him at the Roxy (as a side-bar, we were waiting in line so I go around the back to piss and there was a house turned into a restaurant back there and as I round the corner I run smack into Bianca Jagger, 'excuse me excuse me', with some other model looking chick and they were flat out MOTHERFUCKING BEAUTIFUL they just took my breath away as I watched them get into a cab) anyway Beefheart played great that night. I snuck in a tape recoder. I STILL have the tape, I should bootleg it. He handled the hecklers beautifully (who would fucking heckle Beefheart) "I'll pay your way in here, if you'll get out of here." One time I was living in Santa Cruz and got asked to do a reading at this little bookstore/gallery in LA so I go down there and the chick who owned the joint has a Don Van Vliet art show up! All these small beautiful paintings! Can you imagine? They were only about $800! Jesus. So I get to bullshitting with her and she tells me he was just there the day before putting the shit up, just him and her, and SHE WAS SCARED OF HIM! Ha. I got his address from her, he was living in a trailer in Lancaster then, and I would always send him books. They never came back, so I imagine he got them. He was a BIG influence, though not actually poetically.  
3) Tell me about going to Big Sur in the sixties. I knew that it was near the (spelling) Ensalen Institute which, if I’m correct, was some sort of early new age think tank. I know that Henry Miller lived there and Ferlinghetti let Kerouac stay there but I don’t know anything about the place.
Man, there must have been 9 million hippies there! Everyone on the road hitch-hiking. The smell of hot trees and dope! Beautiful chicks, huge bonfires at night. TOO much. Yeah, Esalon or some shit. I went by there, but never there. What did Kerouac say (I think him) about it? They would sqee-gee the cum off the water in the pool or something. Ferlinghetti's cabin was in this canyon under a huge bridge. The whole fucking place is incredibly beautiful. 
 MAN sounds like all that rain was deadly! SORRY I've been off the air about a week somewhat buzzed but here I am and here we go......................

1)      thanks for the poem. I’m really honored. does this mean I’m famous, or at least a footnote in the books? did ya ever see the Playboy cartoon were the chick is comforting a guy at a crowded bar: “Harold relax, he’s nobody and you’re at least a minor figure.” do you ever feel that way?
OH yeah, now you can go down to Cancun and drink FREE Coronas at any joint that displays my photo! Yeah that cartoon sounds just about right, a Minor figure DEEP inside the margins.
lemme ask you about this poem: lemme reprint here, it is cool and you are a great poet and ostensibly this interview is about you and your poetry-


One Mojo Hand Clapping

for Jim Hayes

their faces are spread too
thin to begin any smile
just be true to yourself
whatever lie it takes
2)      did you ever wonder what Morrison was doing by the time he got into town and the hour later when he started writing the song? is the mojo hand your hand clapping my written work or is it my own?
Probably he already had the chick in the bungalo! No I would say more of a jester in your behalf of "luck" or "protection" in this fucked up difficult GOOD LUCK LIFE, thus just the one hand.
3)      when you say be true to yourself, whatever lie it takes-are you referring to how I adopt different personalities to suit my times and just go with that?
Yes, somewhat, kinda like telling a lie on a food stamp application so you can get something to eat. True to your own survival, no matter what lie, and of course it could apply to actualy lieing to yourself, i.e., crime, drugs, "I won't come in your mouth", blah blah. WHATEVER IT TAKES TO NEGOTIATE LIFE, with dignity.
4)      I haven’t done opiates since Friday and we’re in a flood emergency now-it rained ten inches in Marietta last night and it’s been raining for a week-I don’t mean Oregonian drivel-drizzle (I lived in Hillsboro in 78-80) and I passed through eugene in 87. It’s very depressing.
Yes, indeed. Weather turning here and we're facing our usual 8 month winter of snow and ice, feeding the wood stove 24 hours, really depressing.
6)      what do you think Kerouac and bukowski would have done with the web at their service? it’s fun writing writers huh? but what about the book, where is it gonna go?
I don't think they (Keroauc at least) would have dug it much. Bukowski maybe fucked with it a little. The book is on the way out, probably, making all these hand sewn little poetry books in editions of 100 copies more relevent than ever. You still gotta have something to read around the bonfire when all the power plants get bombed.

FA: I did this once but the computer fucked it up and didn't send it and I didn't keep a draft and then I went on a binge so HERE GOES AGAIN..................
Jim: In your book “hands on a mirror” you keep repeating the great line : “you ask to seek a warm touch.” I’m moved cos I don’t know who the touch is from-where did that come from, what did you mean?
FA: "again to seek a warm touch" That book kind of wrote itself. I had all these poem fragments/notes and I interspersed them with stuff out of this clinical book, THE MIND OF A CHILD MOLESTOR, or some shit like that. I quess it's really a found poem. The warm touch is all there is man, then we die.  
Jim: Sometimes the words seem commonplace but by having a strike though line going through every sentence makes it very powerful. Where did you get this idea? Were the poems in fact discards?
I wanted the reader to think like a stifled ventriloquist, to discount that subvocal speech, and in doing so it made it more powerful. "Why should I discount this?" I've always wanted to do a whole book crossed out, that would be hip.
Jim: Did you really urinate in a bed near a woman and then finish in a pan? Why couldn’t you just go to the bathroom? Where was the sink, where did this happen or is it a story you heard? Please advise.
FA: Hell yes, I've pissed the bed and into their mouths!
Jim: You have a poet laureate being tossed off a bridge. Now is this a national figure or state poet laureate? Amiri Baraka is the poet laureate of NJ and it’s probably fair to say now that Ginsberg’s dead he is the best poet in jersey. Where do they come up with these awards? Did you ever meet Ginsberg?
FA: I love Baraka. That one liner-poem just represents what I feel about 98% of the poets in this country. You fill in the blanks about who it's supposed to be. Pretty much take your pick. Awards are flypaper. I opened for Ginsberg once at Cinema 21 in Portland. I drove 6 hours straight, hungover, almost missing it, and when I was introduced to him, he asked me why I was burned out. He reminded me of a favorite college teacher or something, although a tad more celestial. He was cool. I asked him if he'd seen Giorno lately and he told me just the day before. The Oregonian trashed my performance in the next morning's edition and the promoters told me Ginsberg was pissed off about that over breakfast. His face was tweaked from that stroke.  
Jim: Jim Carroll just died and I liked his prose but I thought his poetry was sort of okay. Any thoughts on his work?
FA: I also met Jim Carroll up in Portland. He had a reading at the Pine St. Theatre and during intermission me and this chick went backstage into these black hallways and found a dim lit room where the promoter was counting out his fee into his open palm. It looked like a drug deal. He was surprised to see us, ha. He was an asshole, but we did sneak up on him I quess, but fuck, no need to be rude to your adoring fans. What's a trip is that we also bullshitted about Giorno! I dig his poems. He went out sitting at his typer, there ain't no better way.  

winter solstice questions 2009
questions for FA Nettelbeck 12-20-09 winter solstice
Jim: why did the writer shift from telling stories about THINGS to writing about HIMSELF?
FA: I don't know, I don't read much. Some people have some pretty cool true life stories tho. But, admittedly, I like some fool in a bar raving about Viet Nam better than reading about it. Nicosia sent me his Jan Kerouac: A Life In Memory, writers writing about SOMEBODY ELSE, and it worked beautifully. A damn good book, sadder than Hank Williams, and it made me feel like old daddy Jack was a total puke.
Jim: seriously, it seems that everything is autobiographical these days-when will the writer go back to just telling stories?
FA: You got me. Perhaps they lack the imagination or the research ability to back the shit up. But there is ALWAYS that element of the autobiography. Cities Of The Red Night, White Fang, Under The Volcano.
Jim:I just read your Christmas story. I like how these guys come up with a plan, Franklin Mint, and then execute it to perfection. It works $80 in bills. I like how you say four twenties cos that’s exactly what they are.
FA: Now, I'm going to disappoint you, but that story is TOTALLY autobiographical. And it happened EXACTLY like that. My old Indian partner Charlie, who died over a year ago (his liver took a shit), and I would do shit like that all the time. I'd play white and he was "the Indian of the group". Back in the day, we almost killed each other at the Sprague River bridge over the same bitch! I still got a three inch scar under this goatee. Where ever you are my brother!
Jim: what is it about these characters that enable them to construct a perfect plan but can’t live with the success?
FA: Shit bro, come and live with me for a month, ha ha! I FUCK UP everything I get going! The Plan is one thing, then you piss away the spoils just to celebrate it. But that is a good thing. Others have heart attacks. 
Jim: why do you throw in the suicide? Wow. That was a shocker.
Again, TOTALLY FUCKING TRUE. That white boy offed himself on Christmas day. Trina in the story was Serena, "Wena", my very first wife. She was my soul partner's old lady but I married her anyway. She stayed with me 5 days. It took a couple of years for the divorce to become final. They both died here in the last couple of years, god damn I miss them. But, yeah, that was a GREAT Indian party house. A lot of shootings, stabbings there. Her and my soul partner's own son blew his brains out with a deer rifle right there in the house next door. Mel Clay always tells me I need to write my "Indian book", Jesus, you talk about a shocker.  
 have you heard Dylan’s Christmas album?
Yeah, that's some funny shit. I hope I DO get a free sandwich somewhere down the road.

Friday, July 8, 2016

Zowie Fenderblast Interview part three

Zowie interview part three 5 June 2010
ZF: for anything to have any meaning for me anymore it has to fit, it has to be very much like a key in a lock. It has to be right. On every important (indistinct) approaching it, and I don’t-just doing something as a show or a song or anything. Basically just having a normal approach-it’s not just do something different but apply it differently and things like that. I'm not trying to be cutting edge it’s just I'm trying not to be bored.
JH: Okay
ZF: So what happened was this: I did something and an entirely new, completely different manifestation of the original idea came into being and I absolutely love it. Because, it is without limits and it’s very simple to do; it’s all very simple to do. And I must be very very (laughs) lucky or some type of coincidence happens or you for some reason you stumble upon this just by accident or something to that effect-you’ll never know I did it.
JH: (laughs)
ZF: except they’ll be a ton of material there but until you punch in the right code-simplest thing in the world-until you punch in the right symbol, it won’t appear. They’ll never find it. and uh…at the very end of it I realized I could use a binary code if I wanted to-not that I want to obscure anything but just to keep track of things like 1,2,3,4,5-so I didn’t want to title any of the videos.
JH: that reminds me of when the yippies would send joints to people in the phone book.
ZF: but the thing is, what I'm going to be doing is, what I'm gonna be doing is and to make absolutely no effort and try to make sure there is no connections to be made. there’s two ways. For instance using the medium of You Tube.
JH: Right
ZF: It’s been out there for years. When somebody posts a video on you tube there are two methods of disseminating that video. (indistinct) you try to promote it: subscribe to my video, rate this video-blah blah blah blah. And one of the automatic functions is, I think they call them “tags” or something
JH: yeah
ZF: so if you’re going to do, like suppose you’re going to do a video on-say Led Zeppelin. Okay this is me talking about Led Zeppelin but I want to make sure that people that are interested in Led Zeppelin-so in the tag section I'm going to put Jimmy Page, Robert Plant-blah blah blah blah blah. So the machine itself will make these connections and you’ll (your video) appear right? Well what if they’re no connections?  what if there are no patterns? and the only way you can find this is by punching in the right code. In the vast, the vast sea of information that You Tube in of itself is-you’ll never find these fucking videos and they’ll never appear. Unless you punch in the code. But if somebody does find them and then it starts to leak out, then-well whatever-I don’t care. It doesn’t matter.
JH: well if you put a video on you tube the first thing I would do is share it to Facebook and then all 66 of my friends on facebook would see it. Oh Jim has a video up. Of those 66 people six or 7 of my friends will look at it. and if I wanted to I could send them a note and say hey can you put this on your page?
ZF: Right
JH: facebook’s an interesting tool like that.
ZF: well I don’t even know what facebook is, it’s some site, a social network-I don’t know anything about it. But it’s odd because if you look at the idea about promoting something, about putting something out and the reason why you present yourself on video or pick up a guitar and record something or whatever is to get yourself out there. For a variety of reasons: maybe you have something to sell, or maybe you just want to express yourself. Or you want to complain about something, or you want to make people aware of your existence. I dunno. it doesn’t matter. But the point is just like-and it’s mirrored in a million different aspects all around us, is to multiply, to spread. And I…I want to bait a trap.
JH: Right
ZF: But I don’t want to-
JH: But already since you-
ZF: But I don’t want to promote it or to be identified with it.
JH: Okay
ZF: I made a discovery yesterday and it was linked to you. Because, I’ve pretty much not had any interaction with people, anybody with any intelligence for about ten years. As far as an outside, besides my wife-
JH: Right
ZF: and it occurred to me, it’s like: well-you get this entity that comes into my life. Maybe I could start poking out into the outside world. Not in any way that normal people do I suppose. And I have nothing to fear, it’s just I’m bored stiff the way most people put things out.
JH: Okay
ZF: it gets back to the kind of things we were talking about, it’s like why Zowie Fenderblast? why Irving God? well I got a new name now.
JH: Okay
ZF: and I won’t tell it to you on tape
JH: Good, good
ZF: I’ll tell it to you later.
(tape recorder shut off)
ZF: This is a story that demonstrates the signal to noise ratio. That I must often encounter at work, it’s about the Loch Ness monster. many years ago when I got my first computer, I had never been on the internet before and I didn’t know what to do. So, for the first experiment I decided to just type in a word from the search engine and see what came up. I had never done it before. And I don’t know what possessed me to pick this particular subject but it just seemed like well: why not? And I typed in Loch Ness monster. And suddenly I was at, I had a choice of hundreds of different sites about the Loch Ness monster. But the one that fascinated me the most I think it was the original loch ness website. What was cool about it and I was very much aware of this because it was all new to me. There I was, I was sitting in my living room and I was able, live, to actually scan both above and below the surface of the Loch Ness as I was back in my living room. Because of this technology they have live cams. So I felt this was novel…so I'm at work the next day, and it was the end of the day and my convicts were assembling for me to put them in the van back to prison. And I was, they were around me and I was sitting on the back deck of our office. I was talking to my boss, he was hanging out there too. And I said hey I got on the internet for the first time and I found out I could sit in my living room and actually search for the Loch Ness monster. And I told my boss basically what this was. I had an inmate by the name of “Jermaine Jackson’ and he was very excitable.
JH: (laughs)
ZF: and he was very opinionated and he also was a complete idiot, which isn’t unusual
JH: those things go together
ZF: Yeah, and he said the following, and I quote, this is his exact words: “Loch Ness Monster! Loch ness Monster! Sheeet, loch ness monster aint nuthin but a  big nigger running through the woods.” And I said, what? “Loch Ness monster ain’t nothing but a big nigger running through the woods.” And I looked at him and said, do you mean Bigfoot? and he looked at me and he was confused, and that’s the signal to noise, okay? You start on this level: Loch Ness Monster. The Loch Ness Monster is also considered to be a mythical beast-what do they call it?
JH: Cryptozoology-
ZF Cryptozoology-a very paranormal, cryptozoological beast, like Bigfoot. Now the Loch Ness monster more or less is perceived as a dinosaur like aquatic creature, it looks like a plesiosaur or something. Whereas another mythological beast, Bigfoot is a bipedal humanoid shape but somehow and I can only guess at this; Mr. Jackson’s ability to connect neurons, the ability to sort things out in his head…any mythical beast can be any other mythical beast. So that gave me the idea like I’m going…I’m going to Loch Ness someday and I’m going to tell everybody there they’re looking in the wrong place.
JH: (laughs)
ZF: Because it’s actually a large black guy running through their forest.
JH: (laughs)
ZF: (laughs) Now imagine if that continues I could literally write a book saying that-and create a website and everything else connecting somehow the Loch Ness monster 2.
JH: Elijah Muhammad.
ZF: Bigfoot, Elijah Muhammad which gets into some of the stuff I was studying yesterday-what I mentioned the Brotherhood of Satan
JH: (laughs)
ZF: one of the other things I do, I pay attention at times to people that study the occult or seemingly study the occult, the Illuminati and conspiracies and stuff and these people are endlessly lost (recording falters)
JH: Burroughs called that the place of dead roads.
(here the tape went out and you can barely hear us talking)
ZF: simply wish to, and I'm not against it but I just wonder why these people chase their ass in a circle endlessly until they drop dead.
JH: You tapped into that with Lee Harvey Oswald band. You picked on a cipher image to people and then the band itself was so mysterious.
ZF: well I have to say you know if there was any idea behind it, Rick (Simms) was behind it cos like I said
JH: You wrote the music I know.
ZF: I wrote the songs and I sang them. And I didn’t, whatever I was involved at the time was doing various things. You know but I had been screwing around with weird ideas for a long time but I personally didn’t have a lot of hand in that.
JH: But there are people who have read all 28 volumes of the Warren Commission report and then spend their whole life talking about the inconsistencies but they never pay attention to the ideology.
ZF: Right
JH: it’s like 9-11 to me these people that speculate there wasn’t enough jet fuel, it was the Jews-to me their idiots, to me that’s not the real question.
ZF: Yes you’re right, absolutely. it’s not the real question, and you know I think LaVey used to mention, something to the effect of rolling shit into little balls, you know, why? You can study anything in minute detail, every time something is copied or passed on, it’s a labyrinth it’s a maze-a pointless exercise in some respects. But I'm not against it, I feel that anyone that wants to pursue something for no reason. well usually they have a reason that’s the only thing I really don’t like about it. They honest to god think, let’s just narrow it down to the population of the United States of America-has the cognitive ability and the interest to look into this stuff and somehow become awake. To this hidden plot or this hidden truth and these people invest a lot of emotional currency in trying to manifest that and uh-if they want to do that it’s okay. I really don’t understand how they can be so oblivious to the complete point. For want of a better word, wasted time-
JH: well I think it’s part of this society’s ideology to keep them involved in the wasted time-
ZF: Sure.
JH: well it’s a lot easier to read the warren commission report and say it’s a lie cos you’re in the possession of the hidden knowledge.
ZF: well here’s a radical statement if you want to call it radical and possibly an illegal statement. Which I love, actual words-actual words that can have you thrown in prison in this country especially. I love that, it’s fucking brilliant. I was watching some documentary footage of protests against the invasion of Iraq. A general war protest that started even before the invasion and even protests against the invasion of Afghanistan. And I watched many documentaries, and when I watch something it’s not usually for the reasons that most people watch something. Again, I am much like HG Wells when he described Martians observing earth-how did he describe it? Something with cold intellect. I watch documentaries many times just to observe human beings I don’t really give a shit what they’re doing. I want to observe them to try to figure out how they arrive at where they are; what the hell they’re thinking. Most documentaries are trying to convince you of something and I don’t care about that. Here’s the good stuff. I’ve watched hundreds of thousands of people put up many hours of video tape about these protests. And I saw all these people carrying signs and protesting, getting sprayed with tear gas and being arrested and marching. Speakers were speaking through microphones and all of this, and…the only question that occurs to me is this: when it comes to political change the only political change that I’ve ever considered effective at all is not voting, not protesting but sending a well aimed bullet at a very high speed into the skull of whoever is trying to turn you into a slave.
JH: Right
ZF: because one thing you’ll notice is that this usually results in death of that person and one thing that you notice about dead people, if you’ve been around a few of them. Well they tend to be pretty fucking mellow. They kinda stop what they’re doing. If they hate (POLITCIAN) so much, if they hate (POLITCIAN b) so much; if they hate these corporations so much and the people…they are hundreds of thousands of these people, you’re gonna tell me that none of them has a rifle? That none of the know-can master the basic skills of marksmanship and figure it, hey this guys gonna be here next week and if I rent an apartment or something I can get a shot at this cocksucker y’know?  America-the reason-the most obvious thing I saw with those protesters was this: they wanted to feel part of the group, they wanted to express their beliefs-but do they really want to stop any of these people? They want to stop them enough…to kill them cos that stops people.
JH: Killing them stops people but you can’t shoot a social relationship-
ZF: I think actually you’ll find politicians, since we’re speaking of politicians, if you were to in one day kill fifty of them
JH: Right
ZF: Their consciousness would change radically.  And the survivors will start to do things in a very different manner.
JH: They would make more police forces.
ZF: Maybe
JH: All 9-11 did was solidify the power structure, it was the best thing that ever happened to them.
ZF: Well yeah, yeah but getting back to the folks that were protesting, apparently they never examined that the find the consciousness of those in power so alien they can’t comprehend it. And, imagine this, it’s very easy for me to completely believe this possible. There is (POLITCIAN), (POLITCIAN b) and everybody that they hated-and I have no use for these fucking people either and I never have. I have no use for any politician. But the entire corrupt evil Bush machine are out there and they’re observing the protests-let’s say a million people are out on the streets in New York City and Washington DC-and they’re having cocktails and sandwiches, the CEO’s of the top fifty companies. I fully believe that it is completely within the consciousness of those people looking down from that building to understand a simple fact, by Monday morning they’ll be gone. And we’ll still be here. Now when you say that bullets or violence cannot stop a social relationship-
JH: You can’t blow up a social relationship.
ZF: Yes you can. I’ve seen it happen. I have to disagree with you, when you examine something like Adolf Hitler and National Socialism. If you apply enough high explosives to any situation (indistinct) and what it’s been since then as far as what it aspired to be-cos there will always be people that want to wear a swastika armband. But the nation of Germany has not gotten that idea and ran with it since. and that was a huge war-
JH: No, no I see what you’re saying
ZF: It needed to be a huge war because there were a lot of fucking people with the same idea that needed to die. and if that was your intent, and suppose you got um, you know the social relationship of the People’s Temple-that’s fucking gone. All that took was chemicals and a little bit of kool aid. Dead people quiet the fuck down. Well the reason why we see terrorists basically so pointless is that there’s not enough of them. Because when you apply real sustained terroristic action consistently, guerrilla action consistently you will cause your enemy to fold.
(tape stops)
JH: what were the words that can get you arrested?
ZF: well apparently its illegal even between you and I, we’re sitting here at this table. If I tell you: “Jim I'm going to come to your house and kill you and your family,” that’s known as a terroristic threat and I can be arrested. But it becomes much much more serious-when you say assassination or suggest that to anyone really in power. It could be a senator, a state representative-they’ve made this little rule saying these people must remain untouched at all times.
JH: if you stand in front of the white house with a sign saying “kill etc” that’s illegal.
ZF: Exactly, two words. Magick words. It’s like going into some rap hip hop bar something like that and start screaming “niggers” at the top of your voice-now that’s a magick word because it causes a reaction.
JH: go into a bank and say holdup.
ZF: Exactly. Go through the security-say “bomb” “hijack”. A word because these people are so tuned-the tension is so high. It’s a reactive thing. Literally by the rules, written down for them-they have to react to it. To you or me it means nothing.
JH: Right
ZF: I have no intention of shooting anyone let alone some politician, but I'm watching these protesters  and I'm thinking if you were in Bolivia or Nicaragua you’d be in the mountains by now shooting anything in a government suit. But because you’re Americans you just want to put on a show. You want to feel better, but you don’t actually want to solve the problem. People, especially nowadays-they have the technology to render people completely harmless-the power has just grown exponentially-which is something I love. It’s tricky the amount-as long as you give people enough ability to vent- any customer complaint department will verify this. Let’em get it out of their system. Six minutes later they wanna shake your hand-
JH: they’re thanking you-
ZF: Right. and as long as people have the ability to call into talk radio and scream and bitch about something or protest in the street. Something like that it’s called a blowoff.
(tape stops)
ZF: The whole strange idea about sports I never understood any of that. I understand it as most people want to direct their attention to sports or entertainment rather than paying attention to their own lives. I’m not even suggesting that they pay attention to politics. Okay, I'm saying you’re actually living a life where every minute that passes you have less time. You are driving towards the grave here. But you want to focus you’re attention on a politician or worrying about whether the government can do something, or worried about a celebrity. More often than not, engaging yourself in this bizarre game of checkers or tiddlywinks involving guys in tight pants and funny hats, throwing a ball around. Now, for over ten years I’ve asked the question of every sports fan I’ve ever met: why do you enjoy sports?
JH: Well I enjoy sports because (tape stops)
ZF: the basic social lubricant nonsense that everyone else is into, they watch sports… They watch what’s popular on American idol, they listen to what’s popular in music that kind of thing. They never engage-f they’ve taken any kind of drugs it’s been under the auspices of a chemical roller coaster ride, for no other reason than to take drugs. Whereas if I was to take a drug it’s usually for a purpose, it’s not so I could see colors. And I'm not saying that the way that I do this is the right way or what they’re doing is wrong, and this is what I'm consistently being surrounded by-and this what is called normal. So I don’t see except for some legal technicalities any differences between the convicts and the people on the street because they act exactly the same. There are people in the street that have a higher degree of moralistic or ethical control. They are constrained by some outside force that are supposedly chosen by them. that’s something I never understood because one thing you do if you’ve worked in prisons, or have worked around people that have no freedom or power. You become acutely and very, very very hypersensitive to what is free and what is not. And that’s why I can’t make much of a difference between people locked up in prison and people walking the street. Because the prison is not a physical prison but they’re walking around with such a headful of nonsense it’s restricting them in a thousand different ways. Apparently, they not only accept this but they love it.